#1

A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Sat Jun 24, 2023 8:25 pm
by Randa france | 12.855 Posts

Last night we were involved in a conversation with a Dutchman who has a brand new Suzuki Vitara 1400 , Hybrid.
He's towing a small Pop top Kip and he is only getting 50 Kms on electric or 250kms combined electric and petrol.
My question is if the car is only doing 200 Kms on a tank of petrol does that mean the petrol consumption is high because of the weight of the car with batteries or is the fuel tank capacity lower as there's less space to fit a full size tank?
Randa

Attached pictures:
No rights to view attachments. Only file names are shown. Register now!
 IMG_20230624_211517~2.jpg 

ERIBAFOLK POP UP EVERYWHERE 1999 Eriba Troll 530 pushing a VW Touran 2L TDi Match . FORUM ADMINISTRATOR


Last edited Sat Jun 24, 2023 8:40 pm | Scroll up

#2

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:00 pm
by eribaMotters | 5.289 Posts

That does not sound correct Roger. The tank is 47 litres, so at just over 10 gallons and I'd estimate 36mpg as reasonable when towing. Lets say 360 miles is possible but you would obviously fill up with a couple of gallons in reserve. So 300 miles is realistic = 480 km.
I recall somebody posting on the forum towing with a 1.4 hybrid petrol Golf. The figures were similar to those I achieve with my 1.5 petrol Audi A3 and previous 2.0 diesel vehicles. It does make you wonder why you would pay a several thousand £ premium as to regain this you would have to do an imense number of non towing miles.
What Car concluded that Hybrids are the most expensive vehicle to run. The calculation was based on purchase cost, insurance, maintenance, depreciation and fuel.

https://www.whatcar.com/suzuki/vitara/4x...1#specification

Colin


Forum Moderator. aka Oscar - Audi A3 1.5 petrol _ ex 430, 552, camplet trailer tent, 310, now a nice white 2017 430.


Last edited Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:01 pm | Scroll up

#3

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:26 pm
by Randa france | 12.855 Posts

Interesting. He's still here so if the chance arises I'll question him further.
As a point of interest I would imagine that a car with an engine and a Boot (?)full of batteries will be a lot heavier than the norm?
R


ERIBAFOLK POP UP EVERYWHERE 1999 Eriba Troll 530 pushing a VW Touran 2L TDi Match . FORUM ADMINISTRATOR
Scroll up

#4

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Sat Jun 24, 2023 9:56 pm
by eribaMotters | 5.289 Posts

Roger, you'll have to pardon me for being cynical. If it has two power sources it is going to be heavier than a petrol only vehicle. Around town on electric only it might be good, but when the batteries run out and you are down to petrol only then you are hauling around a significant amount of extra weight. That is going to show up in higher fuel consumption compared to a petrol only vehicle.

Colin


Forum Moderator. aka Oscar - Audi A3 1.5 petrol _ ex 430, 552, camplet trailer tent, 310, now a nice white 2017 430.
Simboc2004 likes this post!
Scroll up

#5

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Sun Jun 25, 2023 12:06 am
by Steve and Debbie | 1.070 Posts

The 1400 is only a mild hybrid and actually has the same kerbweight as the now unavailable 2021 petrol model

Screenshot_20230625-000012_Drive.jpg - Bild entfernt (keine Rechte)
Screenshot_20230625-000104_Drive.jpg - Bild entfernt (keine Rechte)

Steve


Puck 120 GT - Nissan Pulsar 1.5DCi
Randa france likes this post!
Scroll up

#6

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Sun Jun 25, 2023 9:08 am
by Randa france | 12.855 Posts

Hi Colin. That's exactly what I was getting at.
Anyway I've managed to question him just a moment ago now he (and probably I), am sober and he has changed his tune a bit.
Firstly the two batteries are under the front seats and although he has confirmed that the battery range is poor, but on petrol he can do about 400 Kms as well as the batteries being recharged as you go.
That's better and Mrs R has Just confirmed that what he originally said is how I first reported it.
Randa


ERIBAFOLK POP UP EVERYWHERE 1999 Eriba Troll 530 pushing a VW Touran 2L TDi Match . FORUM ADMINISTRATOR


Last edited Sun Jun 25, 2023 9:11 am | Scroll up

#7

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Sun Jun 25, 2023 9:13 am
by Randa france | 12.855 Posts

Still not getting one though Steve.
As I've said before, my first electric vehicle, if I live that long, will be a three wheeler with a shopping basket on the front.
R


ERIBAFOLK POP UP EVERYWHERE 1999 Eriba Troll 530 pushing a VW Touran 2L TDi Match . FORUM ADMINISTRATOR
Simboc2004 and SOULBLUESMAN68 like this post!
Scroll up

#8

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Mon Jun 26, 2023 9:31 am
by Simboc2004 | 644 Posts

"Self Charging" hybrids with tiny batteries under the seat are, basically, a con to allow them to be sold as hybrids and, therefore, be seen as "green". All they actually are is (usually) heavier petrol cars.

Have you noticed that all the old small cars (Fiesta sized) are going - because they can't fit enough batteries in them to make sense. So cars will get bigger and take up more road space) And a lot of these big electric cars now weigh over 3 tons! We are going down the dinosaur route...


Poppy, our 2005 Eriba 430GT, leading our Volvo V70 astray...


Randa france, SOULBLUESMAN68 and Islay like this post!
Last edited Mon Jun 26, 2023 9:33 am | Scroll up

#9

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Mon Jun 26, 2023 1:48 pm
by cabbie37 | 643 Posts

which we will continue to do until some bright spark solves the problem of how to replenish a hydrogen fuel cell and then battery powered cars will become a thing of the past and we will all be driving hydrogen fuel celled powered vehicles....


Randa france, Simboc2004 and SOULBLUESMAN68 like this post!
Scroll up

#10

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Fri Jun 30, 2023 6:56 am
by Steamdrivenandy | 984 Posts

According to HJ's stats a hybrid Vitara weighs 1275kg and it's petrol only predecessor weighs 1240kg. So a kerbweight difference of 35kg. Both can tug up to 1200kg and the petrol has a 490kg payload, whilst the hybrid payload is 495kg.


I had nothing to do on this hot afternoon
But to settle down and write you a line


Skoda Karoq 1.5 Petrol DSG and a 420. A Bailey Phoenix + 420, with oven, microwave, shower cubicle, solar panel, ATC and external gas point.
Scroll up

#11

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Sat Jul 01, 2023 11:58 am
by Simboc2004 | 644 Posts

So, in 2021 China produced 62% of its electricity from coal - updated to 56.2% last year. So, if you buy a Chinese built electric car (or hybrid) - e.g. MG - then your new "green" car will have been produced using at least 50% coal derived energy and emitting a lot of pollution and heat energy from the power stations.

Buying cars built this way is not the solution to global warming...

Cars have nearly always used less energy in their lifetime than it took to make them, so the answer is to run cars that already exist for as long as possible - or perhaps start a new industry that re-engineers old body shells and running gear with new power units. After all, how many cars are killed by rust nowadays?


Poppy, our 2005 Eriba 430GT, leading our Volvo V70 astray...


Last edited Sat Jul 01, 2023 12:01 pm | Scroll up

#12

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:14 pm
by addisb | 169 Posts

Interesting post Roger.
I posted a few months back that I purchased a Suzuki S Cross ( Ultra) Mild Hybrid . This has the exact same engine and drive train as the Suzuki Vitara Mild Hybrid. They are also available as a " full hybrid". I totally agree with most comments above re. "Electric Cars". Suzuki's Mild Hybrid has a silly.. agreed.. ( small ) battery under the front seat as previously stated but the Full Hybrid, as I presumed your neighbour has, has a large battery which lives in the boot and it a very obvious large block. The Mild Hybrid, as I drive, is not capable of actually driving on Electric only, rather the additional battery and motor assist in acceleration and keep Air Con / Heated Seats etc. on whilst avoiding tickover in traffic etc. The Full Hybrid can drive at lower speeds on Elec only. It has a 33HP Electric Motor.
The Mild Hybrid is available with Manual Gearbox, which I opted for, the Full Hybrid is automatic only. The Mild Hybrid has a 1.4 turbo petrol engine, the Full Hybrid 1.5. To me, both feel pretty much the same to drive. Is he certain that he has the Mild Hybrid !! Can it drive on Electric only ? My understanging is that the Full Hybrid is exceptionally thirsty when towing.
So, fuel consumption: Minus our 310 Famila I was averaging 6.1 ltr/100Km:( 46.3 MPG ) Towing I am averaging 7.0 Ltr/100Km ( 40.3 MPG )
Suzuki advertise 45-50MPG. Fair enough I suppose. His centre screen will have a very obvious reading on his fuel consumption if you could have a look.
I have to say, I am quite pleased with towing performance, it is akin to the 1.6 Ltr. diesel Hyundai I had, both noticeably different to the previous RAV4 2Ltr, diesel.
Chris



Randa france likes this post!
Last edited Sat Jul 01, 2023 9:42 pm | Scroll up

#13

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Mon Jul 03, 2023 11:08 am
by Pepé Le Pew | 2.722 Posts

Quote: Simboc2004 wrote in post #11
...so the answer is to run cars that already exist for as long as possible - or perhaps start a new industry that re-engineers old body shells and running gear with new power units. After all, how many cars are killed by rust nowadays?
The thing is that old running gear is completely incompatible with all the driver aids and associated electronics demanded by legislation.

You'd need to upgrade so much of the car's rolling chassis that it wouldn't be even remotely cost-effective, never mind having to replace the entire electrical system with one which wouldn't fit because all the holes through which it needed to be threaded were in the wrong place or not there at all...

It simply isn't possible or practical to turn an old car into a modern one just by fitting a new power unit.

I think you're right in saying that bodyshell rust isn't what consigns cars to the great scrapyard in the sky any more, and massive improvements in production and lubrication technology mean that engines are far, far more reliable than they've ever been.

Cheaply-made mass-produced cars' lives are often shortened by the terminal corrosion of the bits you can't see without looking underneath - things like fabricated axles and suspension sub-assemblies which are built down to a price and inadequately protected from exposure to the elements and road salt.

And almost every part of the chassis that employed a bush or bearing to function would need to have it renewed as a matter of course as well.

A world full of ancient big-bumpered Volvo 240s with ultra-efficient self-charging hybrid engines, semi-autonomous driving controls and swish LED headlights might be appealing (to some), but it ain't going to happen.

Hydrogen fuel cells.

They're the way ahead.

.



Simboc2004 likes this post!
Scroll up

#14

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Mon Jul 03, 2023 3:40 pm
by Simboc2004 | 644 Posts

Absolutely.

However, in the UK, the government's artificial cut off dates for the end of gas boilers (2026) and internal combustion engines (2030) is driving us all in a rapid rush down the only currently (haha!) available alternative energy supply route. The local supply grids aren't big enough to supply all the electricity needed to run air source heat pumps and charge electric cars overnight. We need a more gradual "plan" for change that will allow hydrogen a bit more time to develop its technology and infrastructure.

I reckon the current govt won't do anything about changing those dates, because they know they won't be in power by then and they're letting their successors take the hit after the next election. Fun times...


Poppy, our 2005 Eriba 430GT, leading our Volvo V70 astray...


Randa france likes this post!
Last edited Mon Jul 03, 2023 3:41 pm | Scroll up

#15

RE: A Question about Hybrid Tow Cars

in We've got it down to a T Mon Jul 03, 2023 4:00 pm
by Pepé Le Pew | 2.722 Posts

Quote: Simboc2004 wrote in post #14
...because they know they won't be in power by then and they're letting their successors take the hit after the next election.

Too right.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

It's a pain in the ruddy arse, that's for sure.
.


Simboc2004, Randa france and scouteralf like this post!
Scroll up


Visitors
0 Members and 28 Guests are online.

Board Statistics
The forum has 12503 topics and 105516 posts.



disconnected Forum-Chat Members online 0